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Shocks
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-25 9:11 AM (#4677)
Subject: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
Does anyone have suggestion for shock replacements. I have #460 I cannot keep it on the road, it's all over the place. So I want to start with the basics. It was toed out about 3 1/2 inches. It still doesn't feel safe to drive.
I can't find any reference to the numbers i found on the shocks that are installed. (made in Canada fronts are 728606 and rears have 727602 stamped on them) I'm hoping someone knows direct replacements numbers for FMCs.
Thanks
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hemi354az
Posted 2017-05-25 11:47 AM (#4678 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Veteran

1001002525
Location: Scottsdale, Aridzona


Front - Monroe #74028, Gabriel #89420
Rear - Monroe #74028 (which I think are too short. I changed to Monroe #74003 at the rear)

There may be other things going on with the suspension/steering. The tail may be wagging the dog. How many miles on #460 ?
Does it have Timbren Rubber Springs added at the rear trailing arms ?
Are the rear shock mount bolts flopping around ? Very bad design by FMC. ONLY shock mount in the world on a floppy bolt !
Here is a solution to the floppy rear shock mount bolts - https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FMCMotorCoach/photos/albums/2095...
Ball Joints, Rod Ends, A-arm mounting to frame, Torsion Rar(s) anchor at the frame ?
These and many other "topics" about FMCs are available by using the SEARCH Feature of this website . . .
Bounce ON! Lou #120
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Duramaxer
Posted 2017-05-25 12:15 PM (#4679 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks



Veteran

1002525
Location: Oslo Norway
Shocks probably isn't your main problem. Unless you have verified that all factors listed by Lou are good, and also your chassis integrity front and rear, steering rag joint, complere steering gear, caster settings, tires, weight distribution and then some . Then you can expect significant improvement of handlig from replacing the shocks IF they are leaking.

Stay cool
Kjetil
#477 Norway.
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LCAC_Man
Posted 2017-05-25 2:07 PM (#4680 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Extreme Veteran

1001001001002525
Location: Oceanside, CA
Lou is right on with the longer rear shock recommendation...they are definitely too short.
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-25 4:29 PM (#4681 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
It has 78000 miles on it. yes someone added the rubber springs already and the shock bolts are not loose looking. they are still in a horizontal position. I had it up on jack stand to inspect the front end while my wife moved the steering wheel back and forth. There was nothing loose that was obvious. I did hear the front end pop a couple times while turning it during driving.
The closest place i could find that does RV front end alignment with independent suspension is 50 miles away. it's going to be a fun drive.
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fmc708
Posted 2017-05-25 5:05 PM (#4682 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks



Regular

252525
Location: Boulder Creek, CA
Hey, on the alignment, I was under the impression that Toeing IN would help with bringing the steering back to front (and wandering), not Toeing OUT. So, do I have that wrong?
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LCAC_Man
Posted 2017-05-25 5:14 PM (#4683 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Extreme Veteran

1001001001002525
Location: Oceanside, CA
A little toe in usually does help.
If you hear a pop when turning then you need to look at your ball joints and your wheel bearings...those are the most likely source for that type of symptom.
In the end you have a 40+ year old rig setting on a rear torsion bar suspension that will certainly have sagged and softened over the years, that combined with a heavy rear end will create the "wag the dog" condition that Lou mentioned...some have had success with adding some significant weight to the front of their coaches...and good experiment would be to fill your water tanks fully and see if it helps at all..
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-25 5:55 PM (#4684 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
I did toe it in so that it was 1/8 in on the front of the wheels a few days ago, i was hoping that was the only problem. I Have no idea how it was out so much, I expected to see something damaged underneath. I did try the full fresh water tank yesterday after i finally fixed all of the plumbing.
Fell off of it today slipped on some moss on the roof while washing it. whoops. That's a long ways down.
I appreciate all of the input.
thanks everyone
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hemi354az
Posted 2017-05-25 7:25 PM (#4685 - in reply to #4684)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Veteran

1001002525
Location: Scottsdale, Aridzona
What is "moss" ?
Lou #120 in Aridzona

ps: Right now, 5:23 PM AZT, Relative Humdidity is 5% and Dewpoint is 14º F.
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LCAC_Man
Posted 2017-05-25 8:22 PM (#4686 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Extreme Veteran

1001001001002525
Location: Oceanside, CA
If I hadn't grown up in Michigan I'd have made the same comment!! LOL!!
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-25 8:52 PM (#4687 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
I'll send you some Lou but as soon as you open it down there it will probably dry up and turn to dust. It's a green substance that grows on everything in western Washington. I was washing it off the FMC to give mushrooms a place to grow
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borrmann
Posted 2017-05-26 6:53 AM (#4688 - in reply to #4687)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Bluevale, Ontario
Sometimes it's not loose parts that affect how the coach steers but seized parts. I've had a number of FMC's that have had binding tie rod ends or bell cranks or idler arms. If you lift the front wheels off the ground and grab one of the wheels, you should be able to somewhat easily rotate the steering gear through its travel, lock to lock. If it is a real struggle, you have binding that needs to be corrected before that coach will ever handle properly.
I had a coach with a clunk in the front end, it was intermittent, only during turning maneuvers, it was a loose upper control arm bushing, not easily seen without close inspection. Frank
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-26 8:13 AM (#4689 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
I will check that out Frank, Thanks
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B. Sitton
Posted 2017-05-26 8:31 AM (#4690 - in reply to #4689)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Veteran

1001002525
Location: Ignacio Colorado
Ball joints and bearings can be checked with the tires off the ground, as well as siezed tie rods etc, but loose or worn parts usually show up when the tires are on the ground. Belcrank and idler bushing play shows up best under load. Look at the thru bolts on the belcrank and idler for movement in the mounting brackets while the steering wheel is moved. Seems like a little play goes a long way.
Bill
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BigRabbitMan
Posted 2017-05-26 11:03 AM (#4691 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks



Elite Veteran

5001001001002525
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
I will endorse what Frank has said above. If you are capable of replacing the parts yourself, the cost of just replacing all of the tie rod ends and ball joints is not that high. I replaced all but the two on the drag link, including the pitman and idler bushings, and then had no issues in next 6,000 miles. I then stopped by Frank's and he did what he describes above. That revealed that I still had a binding tie rod end on the drag link. That was replaced and now I have not gone over 80 mph since.

To identify a binding tie rod end you have to remove it to the point that you can move it yourself.
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-26 11:47 AM (#4692 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
Maybe it's time to get out the pickle fork. I think i read that the ball joints are from a caddy?

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LCAC_Man
Posted 2017-05-26 12:11 PM (#4693 - in reply to #4692)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Extreme Veteran

1001001001002525
Location: Oceanside, CA
Read this: http://www.fmcowners.com/mbbs22/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=696&post...
You may want to consider the H1 ball joint.
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-27 1:23 PM (#4694 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
After i read all of your responses I've decided to replace all tie rod ends and ball joints. I'll just get it out of the way. I was trying to be in denial of having to do it. I figure once i go through the trouble of checking them out i might as replace them and not have to worry about it again.
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BigRabbitMan
Posted 2017-05-27 9:05 PM (#4695 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: Re: Shocks



Elite Veteran

5001001001002525
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
I think that is a good decision. I came to the same conclusion. Mine is now good for the rest of the miles I will put on it.
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Brent
Posted 2017-05-31 8:12 PM (#4696 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
When #460 was given to me it had a bunch of spare parts stocked up with it.
i just found three ball joints and two tie rod ends, NOS. Nothing has zerks on them though.
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LCAC_Man
Posted 2017-05-31 9:14 PM (#4697 - in reply to #4696)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Extreme Veteran

1001001001002525
Location: Oceanside, CA
Given the relatively low cost to buy new joints with zerks and the fairly high labor commitment to install and align them, I'd spend the money for new..
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Brent
Posted 2017-06-16 3:09 PM (#4715 - in reply to #4677)
Subject: RE: Shocks


Contributor

25
Location: Seabeck Washington
I posted a couple pictures of the lower ball joints with grease fittings
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LCAC_Man
Posted 2017-06-17 7:21 AM (#4717 - in reply to #4715)
Subject: Re: Shocks


Extreme Veteran

1001001001002525
Location: Oceanside, CA
Yes, it looks like on the early coaches you have to stick with the factory shaped ball joint, the Hummer H1 ball joint has a different shape to the casting and would interfere with the control arm pocket. The later coaches are open on the top so the shape isn't really a factor.
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